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What would YOU do in this situation?
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Posted on Thu, Dec 29, 2005 14:11

Leaving this information unavailable with no picture when he had the ability to post a picture on the site is deceitful and is lying . Run baby Run!



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Posted on Thu, Dec 29, 2005 12:36

Looks like the military has rolled in to clean up this mess. ;) Anyways, following almost 2 months of discussion, here are:


A FEW CONCLUSIONS I'VE ARRIVED AT...

One of the things that this discussion shows is that, pun unintended, things are seldom black or white. While the openness to other races seems like a no-brainer to me, it may not be for others depending on their upbringing and where they live.. In my case, I have had the benefit of residing in a cosmopolitan, open minded, multi cultural environment where I never felt any form of peer or community disapproval when I began dating my ex back in the early 80s. On the contrary, if people looked at us, it was with smiles on their faces.

I like to think that I would have followed my heart and the conviction of my beliefs under different circumstances, but who's to say I would have if I had been subjected to daily, repeated disapproval and harassment from those around me, treated like a pariah. In fact, had I been raised in a different environment, my beliefs might well have been tainted as well. I suppose that is a perspective that this discussion has led me to consider.

Other than the dating rule, I believe Tall when she says she treats others equally in her daily life. I have to consider where other people grew up and where they live and the fact that their circumstances may be far less hospitable to inter-racial dating than mine. Given that reality, I probably can't hold them to my own standard, a standard established under far less challenging circumstances.

The important result of this discussion may be that each of us reflects for a moment on how we treat others, regardless of their skin colour, the language they speak, or which God they pray to. Do we reach out and seek to include others or do we act in ways that contribute to the climate of distrust and subtle segregation.

Perhaps we have the makings of a few New Year's resolutions...

HAPPY NEW YEAR TO ALL / BONNE ANN?E A TOUS!

  


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Posted on Thu, Dec 29, 2005 09:44

jamajap write:

hondo1952 write:
jamajap write:
Lee..(Hondo),
I was in the Us Army for six years. I came out as a sergeant. I did a tour in Ansbach Germany, Seoul Korea, and Augusta Georgia, Did basic in Fort Jackson, and AIT in Fort Gordon.
Lee I think you and I had this discussion earlier from another thread. But, I do not mind repeating...
Sharon


That's one of the hazzards of growing old. Sorry about that. You must have been in some type of commo to be at Gordon.


Lee, yes, 72E.comm Specialist, But you know as well as I do, That six years in the army you may at any time become, a 76Y,72G, 96B, or a flag bearer, or a bugler, Drill Team(er) or anything else they think you can do or able to do
JUST DO NOT MISPLACE THAT WEAPON, OR CAUGHT WITHOUT IT
Have you ever stayed in the field for two EXTRA WEEKS, because someone misplaced or LOSt their weapon?
Sheesh, he was lucky he returned to batallion alive!!!!
LOL

Sharon


We are nothing if not versatile. That's one of the things that I liked best. As an 11B we ended up doing anything and everything.

Losing a weapon? No way, I was a Ranger. That would have been the kiss of death. My platoon did have a bore sight stolen for an 81MM morter on the DMZ in Korea. That was not pleasant. As platoon sergeant I took responsibility for it and would have been charged for it had I not had a great company and battalion commander.

Nap time. Talk to you later.



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Posted on Thu, Dec 29, 2005 08:53

hondo1952 write:
jamajap write:
Lee..(Hondo),
I was in the Us Army for six years. I came out as a sergeant. I did a tour in Ansbach Germany, Seoul Korea, and Augusta Georgia, Did basic in Fort Jackson, and AIT in Fort Gordon.
Lee I think you and I had this discussion earlier from another thread. But, I do not mind repeating...
Sharon


That's one of the hazzards of growing old. Sorry about that. You must have been in some type of commo to be at Gordon.

Lee, yes, 72E.comm Specialist, But you know as well as I do, That six years in the army you may at any time become, a 76Y,72G, 96B, or a flag bearer, or a bugler, Drill Team(er) or anything else they think you can do or able to do
JUST DO NOT MISPLACE THAT WEAPON, OR CAUGHT WITHOUT IT
Have you ever stayed in the field for two EXTRA WEEKS, because someone misplaced or LOSt their weapon?
Sheesh, he was lucky he returned to batallion alive!!!!
LOL

Sharon

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BQ
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Posted on Thu, Dec 29, 2005 07:52

TallBlonde50 write:
BQ....
You have a point there....Thank you for bringing it to my attention!!!

Happy Holidays!
Tomi


I'm a bit late in replying on this thread: Happy Holidays you too TallBlonde. It was just the wording which I didn't find specific, don't know if it is because English is my second language but I seem to pick these things up lol..

Just thought I would bring it up to your attention, it was the least I could do for a nice and open lady like you.

BQ



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Posted on Wed, Dec 28, 2005 21:07

TallBlonde50 write:


Now, is there anything else you'd like to point out to me?


Yup, when it's all said and done I still think you're a good egg! Thanks for initiating this thread. Perhaps a little contentious at times but, ultimately, constructive.

  


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Posted on Wed, Dec 28, 2005 18:43

jamajap write:
Lee..(Hondo),
I was in the Us Army for six years. I came out as a sergeant. I did a tour in Ansbach Germany, Seoul Korea, and Augusta Georgia, Did basic in Fort Jackson, and AIT in Fort Gordon.
Lee I think you and I had this discussion earlier from another thread. But, I do not mind repeating...
Sharon


That's one of the hazzards of growing old. Sorry about that. You must have been in some type of commo to be at Gordon.



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Posted on Wed, Dec 28, 2005 14:27

Lee..(Hondo),
I was in the Us Army for six years. I came out as a sergeant. I did a tour in Ansbach Germany, Seoul Korea, and Augusta Georgia, Did basic in Fort Jackson, and AIT in Fort Gordon.
Lee I think you and I had this discussion earlier from another thread. But, I do not mind repeating...
Sharon

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Posted on Wed, Dec 28, 2005 13:38

TallBlonde50 write:
Steve, Steve, Steve.....why, oh WHY do I keep having to explain myself??

Tall,

Given that you sound pretty exasperated with me (wink!), I decided to reread this thread from the beginning so as to determine why I continue to be a little confused regarding your position on this topic.

Having read over it again, I've discovered why. It is because you have contradicted yourself a number of times. I think that your position NOW is very clear, but it was the complete opposite early in this thread, hence my confusion.

As mentioned, your position NOW is clear:
You posted on Dec 27:".. even if the black guy was wealthy, goodlooking, whatever, I still would not date him".

That's a pretty definitive declaration that your position is Caucasians ONLY, NOT NEGOTIABLE, and that is fine. It's an honest statement and you're perfectly free to feel that way.

However, for a long time through this thread you implied or stated outright that the man's race had nothing to do with your decision which, obviously, at this juncture, was NOT the case.

In separate posts on Oct 30 and 31 you made the following statements:
"I haven't met him because he lives in AZ and I live in IL. Not exactly around the corner....."

" Hey, I'm not saying I'm wouldn't give the guy a chance."

and

"The email I received from him was indeed intelligent, articulate, and very sweet, and if he lived closer, I would give him a chance. He sounds like a very sweet, caring man".

Obviously, these early declarations did not represent your true position on the matter and were perhaps uttered in the interests of appearing PC (understandable).

POSTED BY BQ on Dec 9: "..This is what you put on your profile for Caucasian man.."Tall, handsome, and Caucasian would be nice :), by saying Caucasian would be nice, it leaves open the suggestion you would entertain someone who is not Caucasian..this is my interpretation. I think you should have put clearly, Caucasian men only please...that leaves nothing to any other interpretation. Just an observation".

You agreed with the gentleman. Given the wording of your profile at the time, why WOULDN'T the African American gentleman send a note? A "preference" for Caucasian implies flexibility, a declaration of CAUCASIANS ONLY is definitive and not subject to interpretation. Your original profile was certainly not as clear as it should have been given your views and, as such, the gentleman should never have been vilified for innocently responding responding, regardless of whether he was black and had not filled out ethnicity.

When it comes to the issue of misconstruing the nature of your initial inquiry, I still contend that this thread is NOT about members filling out all the blanks in their profile. It's about ETHNICITY and the interaction of different races, and the proof of that is that the discussion quickly focused on that. In fact, you yourself confirmed my suspicion in a post you wrote on Oct 31:

"....this is a controversial thread. That's one of the reasons I asked the question!! I wondered just how important ethnicity is to others, and isn't that one of the reasons this forum is here?!?!?!"

There you have it. YOU are wondering how important ethnicity is to everyone and you?re encouraging discussion on the forum! As such, you should not be claiming that people are completely misinterpreting your original inquiry. The discussion took the route it should have naturally taken given the true, underlying crux of the question.

Again, I just wanted to make sure I wasn't "dans les patates", as they say in French (confused). It hasn?t been me misinterpreting your position, it's that your position has been a slightly mobile one throughout the thread. Had you simply uttered your declaration of Dec 27th on Oct 30th, you probably would have saved everyone a lot of typing.

In the end, although it?s been a sometimes uncomfortable exchange, I think we?ve all learned a little. Kudos to you Tall for starting the thread.

  


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Posted on Wed, Dec 28, 2005 13:36

jamajap write:

hondo1952 write:
I apologize to everyone for my outburst last week. I have already talked to GoodLife and she accepted my apology, I hope you all will as well. It was out of character for me to respond in that way and I have felt terrible about it.



Lee,
Sometimes it is good to have "outbursts". Some, may actually deserve it. Especially those who come across as "I have died and arisen" and I sin no more attitude. All the hoity toity BS but yet they are on a site seeking a millionaire. Gimme a break.


And Lee, you know that diabled comment had nothing to do wtih you...I di not even know that until now.
With much respect "top"
Sharon


Thank you Sharon. It's been a long, long time since anyone has called me that.

I just wanted to make sure I was not being deceiving in any way.

Tomi there are things I can not do too well but I figure if I wake up in the morning everything else is a bonus. I didn't know you were in the Corps. When and where did you serve? Officer? Enlisted? How did you like it?

Sharon, when and where were you in the Army? Same old question, Officer? Enlisted?



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Posted on Wed, Dec 28, 2005 12:25

Does that apply to the men who do not put into their profile that they are WHEELCHAIR bound?or disabled? or not good looking?
The only problem I have is guys that do not post pictures. SOme and I said SOME, of them don't so, because if they did...They would not get any responses.
They want you to "get to know the person first" (Sorry) I will get to know you if you have a picture and I like it.
But, then you waste valuable time speaking with someone and when they finally send a pic!...oh! boy!

I simply stop all communications. And would make no inference of disabilities, color of skin, or looks..They will get the message

Just asking

  
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Posted on Wed, Dec 28, 2005 12:18

hondo1952 write:
I apologize to everyone for my outburst last week. I have already talked to GoodLife and she accepted my apology, I hope you all will as well. It was out of character for me to respond in that way and I have felt terrible about it.


Lee,
Sometimes it is good to have "outbursts". Some, may actually deserve it. Especially those who come across as "I have died and arisen" and I sin no more attitude. All the hoity toity BS but yet they are on a site seeking a millionaire. Gimme a break.


And Lee, you know that diabled comment had nothing to do wtih you...I di not even know that until now.
With much respect "top"
Sharon

  
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Posted on Wed, Dec 28, 2005 12:09

jamajap write:
Does that apply to the men who do not put into their profile that they are WHEELCHAIR bound?or disabled?
The only problem I have is guys that do not post pictures, some and I said SOME. of them don'y so it because if they did...They would not get any responses. But then you waste valuable time speaking with someon and when they finally send a pic!!1...oh! boy!

I simply stop all communications. And would make no inference of disabilities, color of skin, or looks..They will get the message

Just asking


Since reading this I guess I'd better put in my profile I am a disabled veteran. I'm not in a wheelchair or anything like that but nonetheless i am 100% disabled. I was not trying to deceive anyone. If someone is interested in me I usually say something about it during the initial correspondence.

Lee



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Posted on Wed, Dec 28, 2005 12:05

I apologize to everyone for my outburst last week. I have already talked to GoodLife and she accepted my apology, I hope you all will as well. It was out of character for me to respond in that way and I have felt terrible about it.



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Posted on Wed, Dec 28, 2005 09:52

GeminiDi write:
I think we can all agree that NO ONE needs permission or acceptance from anyone else on the people we choose to date. We're adults, after all.

Hopefully, we can take the positive aspects from this thread and learn from them.

libitofafrica, I think you will accomplish more to help people overcome the barriers of prejudice ... whether it be race, religion, gender, status, etc., if you will be more empathetic in your responses.

Good luck to you all in your search for the "perfect FOR YOU" match!

Gem


Oh, I beg to differ...

Regardless of what the profile says, if they don't pass the puppy test, out the door they go! :o)



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Posted on Wed, Dec 28, 2005 07:51

libitofafrica write:

So personally, I discriminate and have racist views about white people your age and that's ok because it is my PERSONAL PREFERENCE.


And that being the case, we are simply overjoyed that you have joined us!!! Perhaps you might pay your membership fee so that you can troll in a more efficient/timely manner.

If only you were as well read and literate as you are militant, you might be on to something...

I am still snickering about your "history lesson" from the other thread... Exactly when did the "100 years of American Slavery" begin and end??? ROFLMAO...

And BTW, slavery is still practiced in your continent of origin to this day, what pray tell is your opinion of that???

But perhaps that would be best suited for a seperate thread, as it has nothing to do with the original topic of the thread of "lying by ommission"...



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Posted on Tue, Dec 27, 2005 15:53

steve475 write:

robtest write:


. just seems you have a big chip on your shoulder about the topic. That in itself speaks volumes as to the validity of your arguments... Preach on if you must,as is your right as a paying member, but I think you will find no baptisms here today...



Rob,

I do not know if you've taken the time to read through the entire thread, perhaps not.

If you have, you will have observed that I have not, at any time, recommended that everyone should be willing to date any race. What I have advocated is looking at why one excludes other races, why the colour of one's skin makes a big difference to some people (primarily white people).

We all have prejudices (myself included), pre conceived notions about certain races , and the benefit of this discussion would be that we can each reflect on these and, perhaps, be a little more understanding and sensitive to prejudices that serve to subtly exclude others from many areas aside from dating.

Of course everyone is free to date or not date whoever they want. I'm not interested in "converting" anyone to the idea of dating outside one's own race. Each person walk's their own path.

As for having a big chip on my shoulder when it comes to this topic I don't see it. All my posts on this thread are from the heart. Might there be reasons I have a very personal interest in this topic? Absolutely.

As to the validity of my "arguments" you're more than welcome to disagree 100% with every one of them just as I have disagreed with many throughout this thread. The difference is, while I might disagree, I have not found it necessary to hurl any personal insults at anyone nor accuse anyone of "preaching" if they have advocated an opposing view.

We all understand that the topic which has evolved is a potential minefield but that does not mean we cannot discuss the issue civilly.


Thanks for the clarification! Perhaps it is my perception of your condescending tones that causes me to take issue with your words... I guess that in itself might be a cultural bias. Sorry if we have miscommunicated.

Namaste!



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Posted on Tue, Dec 27, 2005 15:37

robtest write:


. just seems you have a big chip on your shoulder about the topic. That in itself speaks volumes as to the validity of your arguments... Preach on if you must,as is your right as a paying member, but I think you will find no baptisms here today...


Rob,

I do not know if you've taken the time to read through the entire thread, perhaps not.

If you have, you will have observed that I have not, at any time, recommended that everyone should be willing to date any race. What I have advocated is looking at why one excludes other races, why the colour of one's skin makes a big difference to some people (primarily white people).

We all have prejudices (myself included), pre conceived notions about certain races , and the benefit of this discussion would be that we can each reflect on these and, perhaps, be a little more understanding and sensitive to prejudices that serve to subtly exclude others from many areas aside from dating.

Of course everyone is free to date or not date whoever they want. I'm not interested in "converting" anyone to the idea of dating outside one's own race. Each person walk's their own path.

As for having a big chip on my shoulder when it comes to this topic I don't see it. All my posts on this thread are from the heart. Might there be reasons I have a very personal interest in this topic? Absolutely.

As to the validity of my "arguments" you're more than welcome to disagree 100% with every one of them just as I have disagreed with many throughout this thread. The difference is, while I might disagree, I have not found it necessary to hurl any personal insults at anyone nor accuse anyone of "preaching" if they have advocated an opposing view.

We all understand that the topic which has evolved is a potential minefield but that does not mean we cannot discuss the issue civilly.



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Posted on Tue, Dec 27, 2005 14:56

steve475 write:

robtest write:


Just because her opinion differs from yours on the subject of inter-racial dating in no way obligates her to explain her inner most thought processes to you. Her personal preference is not to do it. RESPECT THAT... go on with your life...

She probably doesn't like dating jerks either, perhaps you are equally qualified to lecture her on that too??? I hope that is not too nuancy for you.



No need to get your BVDS in a knot Robbie. This thread is one amongst thousands here.

If my comments upset you or make you uncomfortable (as they obviously do given your catty comments ;) I am sure that you will find other topics where you can ride in and protect the weak and defenseless. To date, Tall and others have shown themselves to be more than capable of discussing and debating the various facets of this topic in a mature and intelligent manner.

Just as Tall is under no obligation to explain her inner most thought processes, neither are you obligated to read my comments if they tend to upset and exasperate you.

PS: While the attempt at keyboard chivalry is admirable, the smug "jerk" inference is pretty "12 yrs old". Better bring that testosterone level down a notch there.



no panty wads here stevie... just seems you have a big chip on your shoulder about the topic. That in itself speaks volumes as to the validity of your arguments... Preach on if you must,as is your right as a paying member, but I think you will find no baptisms here today...



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Posted on Tue, Dec 27, 2005 14:34

robtest write:


Just because her opinion differs from yours on the subject of inter-racial dating in no way obligates her to explain her inner most thought processes to you. Her personal preference is not to do it. RESPECT THAT... go on with your life...

She probably doesn't like dating jerks either, perhaps you are equally qualified to lecture her on that too??? I hope that is not too nuancy for you.


No need to get your BVDS in a knot Robbie. This thread is one amongst thousands here.

If my comments upset you or make you uncomfortable (as they obviously do given your catty comments ;) I am sure that you will find other topics where you can ride in and protect the weak and defenseless. To date, Tall and others have shown themselves to be more than capable of discussing and debating the various facets of this topic in a mature and intelligent manner.

Just as Tall is under no obligation to explain her inner most thought processes, neither are you obligated to read my comments if they tend to upset and exasperate you.

PS: While the attempt at keyboard chivalry is admirable, the smug "jerk" inference is pretty "12 yrs old". Better bring that testosterone level down a notch there.



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