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leonicvir...
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Posted on Sun, Nov 24, 2013 06:20

It was November 4,1979 when 52 American hostages were taken after Iranian's overran our Embassy. This spelled doom for the Carter Administration, especially with the failed rescue attempt, and fuel for Reagan in the hot presidential election. The hostages were released under the Algiers Accord,one day prior to Reagan taking the power of President in the U.S.. The rest is history, until this new momentum of Diplomatic talks,and a proposal to lift sanctions if the Iranian's abandon their quest for nuclear weapons.

What do You think? Will this be an "I told you so" moment the Isrealies are taunting, or the chanced breakthru the Obama Administration rode out of Syria on.



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Livnl...
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Posted on Wed, Dec 18, 2013 02:36

Quoting Dakota35:

Go to Iran and live (you being a woman) see if you come back with the same opinion.  I know a American woman (neighbor) that was married to a man from Iran.  She was abused by him, then traveled to Iran to live, she barely escaped with her life.  I know another man from Iran that stole his mothers life savings, ant then purchase a huge home on a large track of land.  Women are not respected in Iran.  I would say that the progressives have very little chance of gaining power without some world intervention.

 

Had another friend from Iraq.  We went to war with Iraq and he was very much on the side of the US.  In fact he left his country and hated the leadership.

 

Had another friend from Turkey...okay, he was just strange, not much to say about him.

 

And I'm sure that StunningYetShy could give you all the info you'd ever want to know about Iran.  And if she disputes what I say, then I'll shut up as she would surely be the authority and much more knowledgeable on the subject.



But you do know the role the US and the UK played in creating the Iran of today that is now a problem? We tend to wade in, depose leaders and instal the ones we 'hope' we can control to do our bidding...but then many years down the line, times change and the tides with it.

 

Similar notions were almost brokered with the Syrian situation when the UK and much of Western Europe [EU] seriously proposed arming the rebels with deadly weapons to fight against the government forces. If this is done, how do we control how those weapons are deployed and used by these rebel groups and that they would not later use it against us in the future? These were the obvious burning questions no one was prepared to answer during the negotiations. My beloved country Britain was in the forefront of this proposition which obviously spells future disaster. One of the problems we have and we will continue to have is that politicians have no long term goals or continuity for any country or people they govern - it is a matter of the now - what can I do to put my name on the world landmark/history, NOW? I don't care if 50 years down the line it backfires....the government of that time will deal with the mess! That is what gets a lot of us into the mess we are in today!

 

Women are also not respected in the West - that is a fact! We are just better at hiding our institutional disdain and disrespect of women. I cannot count how many women are locked up in Holloway Prison in London as I write this post - who have committed absolutely no offence other than to have been married or coupled with abusive men - and who were not tried by a competent court or by a jury of their peers!

 

I do not see the BBC or CNN rushing to cover these horrific, but silent howls from within these prison cells!

 

Same goes for abused women and children trapped in the family justice systems of the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, New Caledonian, UK, and the whole of Western Europe!

 

India pretty much showcased to the whole world how much disdain and disrespect they have for women with the broad daylight brutal gang rape and murder of that poor young lady.

 

Irrespective of these foregoing, Iran's nuclear weapon ambition must be checked - but how do we do that?

 

Liv.



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Diana33...
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Posted on Tue, Dec 10, 2013 16:30

Quoting Dakota35:

If it were not for liberals, all conservatives would "engage in positive thinking, because the world would be a beautiful place. ;-)  I really don't believe that but just had to say it...as my other replies have been deleted.  Diana, here we are  debating a issue that neither of us have any control over.  Why do we do that?

 

A small nuclear bomb would be a extreme, that's the kind of thing that is said behind closed doors in anger and should not be said in public.  I will agree that is a "Dim-witted" statement.  What a fool, we should use the largest nuclear bomb we can make...okay bad joke. :-)


Hah-ha!  We do it because we like it.  The same reason people do a lot of things that they do.  *wink*  :))



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Diana33...
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Posted on Sat, Dec 07, 2013 16:17

Dak~

I don’t know why conservatives continually engage in negative thinking, often repeating/circulating false prophecies of America’s decline.  Remember Japan in the 80s?  The Chinese scare…whose economy is currently growing in the single digits?  Rapid growth in the beginning does not necessarily result in an endless growth model. It’s a myth that America is in decline….used to manipulate and scare people!

 

There is no other country that can do the job of being the world’s housekeeper.  We are the default power and it will take a liberal/open minded government to work and build trust with other nations in order to keep that influence effective.  While I support the Obama administration agenda of nation building at home, it is currently in the process of retraction from the world which seems a little concerning.  Japan has quietly amassed the 3rd largest surface navy and we need to focus on these types of things in order to keep them under our umbrella of influence.

 

Iran’s nuclear weapon program started under the Shah in the 70s, which we supported and facilitated by the way.  Some of that housekeeping involves cleaning up our own mess.  The most recent well organized sanctions have been very powerful and are nothing short of a diplomatic feat.  The new government of Iran definitely wants to get rid of the sanctions.  The open question is if we can re-install them if Iran does not follow through with their agreement, including moving forward with more negotiations to limit their nuclear program.  Re-installing sanctions will not be an easy task.  It is in everyone’s interest to see our influence be successful in these negotiations, but the Obama legacy is riding on this one for sure.  This really IS the big one….unlike all the discredited scandals and wailing over a poorly implemented web site. 

 

You are right though about nuclear weapons killing millions of people.  That is why I almost fainted when I heard of a House Republican suggesting on C-SPAN that instead of all this talking the Obama administration is trying to do with Iran, we could preemptively "hit them with a tactical nuclear weapon” and “set them back a decade or two or three."   (Google it if you don’t believe me)

 

I guess we are to believe that dropping a small nuclear bomb in the Middle East is MUCH less dangerous than talking!  Dim-wit!!!  These guys really need to be gone.  Does he really think nuclear weapons come in size small????



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leonicvir...
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Posted on Thu, Dec 05, 2013 11:05

Iranians were the original Bedoin's, and may connect to the land of nod  (Cain(wanderers,enterprise middle men)), especially with trade route customs established between clans, tribes,  buyers, and sellers within Iran. They are calculative, and want to stiffly control change. The riots where Police thugs were dragged from their assalting, little motorcycles shows authority being challanged. The presures of society play a role in the quiet shift of Iran's tone, both in, and out of it's borders. They are testing how far change will go, and if it coinsides with the ruling Priest. These are history wise elders, still cherished for their stand. Ishmael would build 10 nations that would be cohesive-Islamic nations. The Jewish mix had begun. Abraham, and Issac 's firstborn created new branches; Esau being associated with red featured cultures. This boils down to a resistance to change, and a force to ensure stability in a world starkly different from their own. 

Their centrifuges were damaged by Stuxnet,a virus that make the motors of the centrifuges run past maximum speed(they run at close to speed of sound), corrupting the motor controler. Pakistan has mass produced these for years in many countries to sell to N Korea, China, Iran, and any other buyer. Why that was not challanged baffles me. 

There is a grey area with the amounts.

This negotiation should be a welcomed, challanging, Reagenistic-like, total proof situation. There are never, true total proofs. 



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Diana33...
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Posted on Tue, Dec 03, 2013 22:21

Quoting Dakota35:

"acting like a bloviating bully toward other sovereign nations has not seemed to have produced many foreign policy successes" 

 

Since when would someone that has the best interest of the world be called a "bully"? USA a "bully"? Israel a "bully"?  Such a small nation surrounded by those that only wish their destruction.  No not a bully, but a nation that wants peace and sometimes peace comes through force.  As I said, America created the nuclear bomb...it is of our creation therefore it is our responsibility to control it.  The US is not a "bully" we are peace makers...and we do so through whatever means needed.

 

The US leadership is viewed as weak, therefore nothing we say installs enough fear in Iranian leaders.  Therefore, I do not believe that any type of sanctions or foreign policy will stop Iran, despite what they agree to.  Iran gaining nuclear power is just a huge bargaining chip and that's what they want.  Once they get a nuke then they will start making demands accompanied by threats.


Oye vey Dak!!  I suppose "peace makers" just depends on which side of the fence you sit on?  So you think we should tell the world that we are going to make peace.....even if it means blowing you into the 18th century?  Some might say that's a similar doctrine as telling a woman...."You're going to act the way I want you to or else I'm going to beat you to a bloody pulp".
 
Why do you say "US leadership is viewed as weak"?  Let me ask you....do you get a positive response from others if you approach them acting like a disrespectful A-hole?  I think it's a misjudgment to view measured, rational thinking as weakness.  Remember, it was the Obama administration that put in place the toughest sanctions ever imposed on the Iranian government, including for the first time targeting Iran's entire financial system.  Just because we're sitting on the most powerful military force in the world, doesn't mean we have to go around acting like a dim-witted Neanderthal.
 
PS:  There is a really great book, How to Win Friends & Influence People by Dale Carnegie.  It's really very good and I highly recommend it. 

 



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Diana33...
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Posted on Sun, Dec 01, 2013 21:46

Quoting Dakota35:

A peaceful solution is always the better options, no argument.  But can we trust Iran?  What does history tell us?  What weapons has Iran supplied to other Arab nations that have been used to kill Americans?  

 

What should be written in any document that Iran agrees to, is ,that under breach, a military strike upon nuclear facilities will be assured.  Of course they will argue "breach" and say they didn't and the world will be divided. 



Well the hard work is still ahead.  The Iranian govenment made this exact same offer back in 2005...but the Bush administration refused to accept it, giving the Axis of Evil speech.  Since then Iran began investing billions and billions into their nuclear program, amassing more than 8000 centrifuges now.  What we have at this point is only a freeze for 6 months, while we try negotiate another step toward getting them to dismantle what they invested so heavily in.  It's going to be very difficult.

 

There is no doubt that we need to be very cautious and not be naive in these negotiations.  But one thing seems clear to me.....acting like a bloviating bully toward other sovereign nations has not seemed to have produced many foreign policy successes.  Repairing our foreign relationships has been no small accomplishment.



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Diana33...
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Posted on Sat, Nov 30, 2013 17:12

November 25, 2013 By Barbara Slavin

 

In exchange for 7 billion in sanction relief, Iran will stop refining uranium to 20 percent U-235 – very close to weapons grade. Iran will convert the 200 kilograms of 20 percent uranium it has amassed to a form that cannot be easily enriched further. The deal will also freeze most work at a heavy water reactor called Arak that if completed, could yield plutonium, another potential bomb fuel. And it will provide the International Atomic Energy Agency with unprecedented daily access to Iranian enrichment plants as well as potential answers to questions about alleged past weapons research at military sites. All of this has long been sought by the international community in vain.

 

 


******

It’s a process Dak.  I am hopeful that this is a first step on the road to enhanced human rights throughout the Middle East and



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Diana33...
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Posted on Sat, Nov 30, 2013 08:19

Quoting Dakota35:

Go to Iran and live (you being a woman) see if you come back with the same opinion.  I know a American woman (neighbor) that was married to a man from Iran.  She was abused by him, then traveled to Iran to live, she barely escaped with her life.  I know another man from Iran that stole his mothers life savings, ant then purchase a huge home on a large track of land.  Women are not respected in Iran.  I would say that the progressives have very little chance of gaining power without some world intervention.

 

Had another friend from Iraq.  We went to war with Iraq and he was very much on the side of the US.  In fact he left his country and hated the leadership.

 

Had another friend from Turkey...okay, he was just strange, not much to say about him.

 

And I'm sure that StunningYetShy could give you all the info you'd ever want to know about Iran.  And if she disputes what I say, then I'll shut up as she would surely be the authority and much more knowledgeable on the subject.


Indeed Dak.  I think most of us have heard the stories about the brutality of Middle-eastern men towards their women.  In all fairness, some Caucasian men can be equally brutal…..but perhaps it is not as wide spread here.  Thankfully our Federal Government reconizes something called "Human Rights".   

The bottom line….it’s not good or right for men to brutalize women anywhere…..and society….especially other men should stand up against it where ever it is known!  It’s difficult to deserve respect if you act like a vicious animal.

 

 



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Diana33...
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Posted on Fri, Nov 29, 2013 08:32

Iran is not just some third world country armed with pitch forks.  They are a REAL country!  AKA Persia….a proud people with a culture that has made MANY significant contributions to the world.  They will fight if we attack them…..and the blood of our babies will run like rivers in the streets.  No one can predict the outcome of such a war. 

 

To preemptively Bomb, Bomb, Bomb Iran, starting another war is just dumb!  This agreement can be viewed as a place to start, by giving the people of Iran a chance to change the direction of their old religious Iyatollah government.  I believe/hope young progressive Iranians want to join the rest of the world....thereby presenting an opportunity for their nation to compete economically and intellectually on the world stage.  In turn we can invest in our own country instead of blowing up our treasure in another.



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Posted on Thu, Nov 28, 2013 06:55

Your comment truly represents the merit in all that is being done...

Those who seem to disdain absolutely anything done by those currently at 1600 Pa Ave DC need to gain a better perspective on history.  Thousands have died, ten plus thousands permanently scarred by the current malaise in Iraq that we started and solved absolutely nothing in the large picture.

The blunder in Iraq is a permanent stain on our record as the bright light on the hill!

 

Maybe with Iran we can gain some lost ground?



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Diana33...
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Posted on Wed, Nov 27, 2013 21:02

I would say....."Give Peace A Chance".

 

If it doesn't work.....at least we, and even the entire world will know that we tried before we went to WAR!



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leonicvir...
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Posted on Tue, Nov 26, 2013 23:07

Well, These diplomatic constructs with Seria(still under threat for noncompliance), stiff guidelines for the Iranians, and some sort of poker face demeanor; puts Obama in play. There is further agenda this Constitutional Lawyer wants to obtain, and properly executing his Office as President is priority. This Leo weighs multiple scales, and has since Campaign,2007-8. We have toned down defense,and trained more Special Forces. Those forward bases,still in Afghanistan will stay, and we pay some of the bill for Karzai's army-which may turn on us as the eagle flies. Israel is doing what the Judah Tribe (Leo's) does best; Negotiate till solid proof is established, and secure their country. 



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Randomintuiti...
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Posted on Tue, Nov 26, 2013 01:55

If you were to look at the scandal from other sources you will see that they purposely prolonged the hostages to make Carter look bad. That whole ordeal was hoaxed. The rest of the world points the finger about nukes when they themselves have them. Iran has not invaded any country look at how many countries the US has been involved with militarly and coupes since the 80s and say who is more a threat? Everyone pleas and gets all teary eyed for Israel and their cryout for a defence it is all gator tears while they sit back and enfore apartheid. Iran has a right to have nuclear energy and if so they want to have a bomb it will stablize the region and keep america from messing with them. Personally i dont care because politics is a big landfill and you only get one side of the story. They talk about Iran why dont they go help the people being massacred in Syria?



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