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Diana3316
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Posted on Thu, Aug 01, 2013 22:46

In 1975, NYC was on the brink of disaster….bankruptcy.  President Ford gave a speech that he would deny the city Federal assistance.  Suggesting that the second largest city in the world at the time should be allowed to go bankrupt was not popular.  President Ford went to an economic summit in Europe and was told by world leaders, that it would be viewed by the world if NYC went bankrupt that in essence America was bankrupt, resulting in a global financial calamity.  Ford reconsidered and gave NYC a federal loan, which was paid back with interest…and now NYC…Times Square, etc….is the pride of our nation!

 

Today, Detroit’s debt is 18 billion dollars.  On Thursday it became the largest city in American history to file for bankruptcy.  While Detroit suffered for years under mismanagement and corruption, often under Democratic officials, today Detroit is fast becoming the most Libertarian city in the US.  In many areas, there are basically no public services, decaying roads and bombed out infrastructure.  40% of the street lights don’t work at night, leaving a troubled city shrouded in darkness, where even police and emergency services have literally become optional.

 

And what is the Republican Governor’s solution???  Give up and fail!!  By declaring bankruptcy they have wiped the slate clean, setting the stage to privatize and carve up city assets.  In the process, city workers that have worked for 35 years and paid into their pensions are at risk of losing it.  Yet…they can guarantee the $500 million bond for a downtown arena!  I would hate to think what would have become of my father and mother in their old age if Daddy had lost his pension.

 

While conservatives want to blame the people of Detroit and the labor unions for the mammoth financial problems, I do not think that is a fair or full assessment.  A city cannot lose 300,000 manufacturing jobs over the last 30 years and have a sustainable tax base. 

 

Policies like free trade, outsourcing, withholding of State money from the city and deregulation of Wall Street which hurt the pensions and caused the housing crisis are all major contributors to the trashing of Detroit.  When a city loses 90% of its manufacturing jobs, the tax base erodes resulting in reduced public services, reduced public safety and a depopulation of an area….more eroding of the tax base.

 

America should care about Detroit and should care about all our cities.  After all….that’s where 80% of us live.  Detroit is a great American city!  We would never have won WWII if it wasn’t for Detroit and the American worker.  We nation build all over the world!  We spent billions and billions rebuilding Bagdad!  Why can’t we invest and rebuild Detroit???  Where is our love for American workers?  Where is our love for our community?

 

This is not a liberal or conservative challenge.  The de-industrialization of Detroit and this country is an American challenge!

 

A give up and surrender solution is not worthy of our great nation!!



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Dakota35
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Posted on Mon, Aug 05, 2013 08:53

Quoting NGL2011:

Diana, I took your question as genuine,,but it does start a debate of a political nature. Basically Liberal vs Conservative ideas, and to me thats an old worn out debate.



Old and worn out like the politicians in both parties.



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MillionDollarBab
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Posted on Mon, Aug 05, 2013 08:41

Quoting Diana3316:

In 1975, NYC was on the brink of disaster….bankruptcy.  President Ford gave a speech that he would deny the city Federal assistance.  Suggesting that the second largest city in the world at the time should be allowed to go bankrupt was not popular.  President Ford went to an economic summit in Europe and was told by world leaders, that it would be viewed by the world if NYC went bankrupt that in essence America was bankrupt, resulting in a global financial calamity.  Ford reconsidered and gave NYC a federal loan, which was paid back with interest…and now NYC…Times Square, etc….is the pride of our nation!

 

Today, Detroit’s debt is 18 billion dollars.  On Thursday it became the largest city in American history to file for bankruptcy.  While Detroit suffered for years under mismanagement and corruption, often under Democratic officials, today Detroit is fast becoming the most Libertarian city in the US.  In many areas, there are basically no public services, decaying roads and bombed out infrastructure.  40% of the street lights don’t work at night, leaving a troubled city shrouded in darkness, where even police and emergency services have literally become optional.

 

And what is the Republican Governor’s solution???  Give up and fail!!  By declaring bankruptcy they have wiped the slate clean, setting the stage to privatize and carve up city assets.  In the process, city workers that have worked for 35 years and paid into their pensions are at risk of losing it.  Yet…they can guarantee the $500 million bond for a downtown arena!  I would hate to think what would have become of my father and mother in their old age if Daddy had lost his pension.

 

While conservatives want to blame the people of Detroit and the labor unions for the mammoth financial problems, I do not think that is a fair or full assessment.  A city cannot lose 300,000 manufacturing jobs over the last 30 years and have a sustainable tax base. 

 

Policies like free trade, outsourcing, withholding of State money from the city and deregulation of Wall Street which hurt the pensions and caused the housing crisis are all major contributors to the trashing of Detroit.  When a city loses 90% of its manufacturing jobs, the tax base erodes resulting in reduced public services, reduced public safety and a depopulation of an area….more eroding of the tax base.

 

America should care about Detroit and should care about all our cities.  After all….that’s where 80% of us live.  Detroit is a great American city!  We would never have won WWII if it wasn’t for Detroit and the American worker.  We nation build all over the world!  We spent billions and billions rebuilding Bagdad!  Why can’t we invest and rebuild Detroit???  Where is our love for American workers?  Where is our love for our community?

 

This is not a liberal or conservative challenge.  The de-industrialization of Detroit and this country is an American challenge!

 

A give up and surrender solution is not worthy of our great nation!!



Hi Diana, 

I'm trying to learn this quote feature.  Hmmm...

"A city cannot lose 300,000 manufacturing jobs over the last 30 years and ahave a sustainable tax base." 

I just didn't realize that had happened.  

 

Bab



Bab : )

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NGL2011
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Posted on Mon, Aug 05, 2013 02:15

Quoting Diana3316:

Fair enough NGL.  I don’t much like our current political environment either.  But if I am passive and turn away from current events, I will likely not be informed enough to make a quality judgment to vote my values. 

 

Leadership is doing the right job.  Management is getting the job done right.

 

When I look at politicians, I don’t look for the one I like the best!  I look for the one that believes as I do.  If I believe in the values of Love for my community, One nation under God and Do on to others as I would want done onto me…..then I look for the person who is likely to vote for policies that support those values.

 

My questions were genuine.  They were not posed in an effort to start a political fight….but in an effort to see if you knew something that I didn’t.  I thought perhaps you had well-reasoned ideas of why privatization was a good thing for Detroit.



Diana, I took your question as genuine,,but it does start a debate of a political nature. Basically Liberal vs Conservative ideas, and to me thats an old worn out debate.



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Diana3316
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Posted on Sun, Aug 04, 2013 12:28

Quoting NGL2011:

Diana,, your not going to pull me into a political debate,, I hate politics !   LOL I'll leave that to you and your brother..:) I will answer one of your questions though,,IMHO,,it's not a child and shouldn't be looked at it in the same light.

 

I'm pretty sure though, the guy you voted for President will bail them out. ;)


Fair enough NGL.  I don’t much like our current political environment either.  But if I am passive and turn away from current events, I will likely not be informed enough to make a quality judgment to vote my values. 

 

Leadership is doing the right job.  Management is getting the job done right.

 

When I look at politicians, I don’t look for the one I like the best!  I look for the one that believes as I do.  If I believe in the values of Love for my community, One nation under God and Do on to others as I would want done onto me…..then I look for the person who is likely to vote for policies that support those values.

 

My questions were genuine.  They were not posed in an effort to start a political fight….but in an effort to see if you knew something that I didn’t.  I thought perhaps you had well-reasoned ideas of why privatization was a good thing for Detroit.



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Diana3316
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Posted on Sun, Aug 04, 2013 11:45

Quoting Dakota35:

So your brother got the good gene. :-)


Lolololo.....well....maybe so Dak.  But...I got the good stuff!!!  *wink*

 

The House GOP put forth:

- 46 Abortion Bills

- 113 Religion Bills

- 73 Family Relationship Bills

- 36 Marriage Bills

- 72 Gun Bills

- 0 Jobs Bills

 

THEY NEED TO LOSE THEIR JOBS!!


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Dakota35
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Posted on Sun, Aug 04, 2013 07:51

So your brother got the good gene. :-)



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NGL2011
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Posted on Sat, Aug 03, 2013 18:23

Quoting Diana3316:

Hey NGl~

Thanks for your response.  My brother lives in Dearborn and is an engineer for Ford.  We are polar opposites politically…..so as you can imagine Thanksgivings are lots of fun at Mother’s house!   *wink*

 

I don’t know a lot about bankruptcy law, but my general understanding is that the party defaults on what is owed.  Hmm….so if Detroit doesn’t want to default on their sports arena….or sell their Picasso artwork….what are they going to default on?  And what happens to all those people losing pensions?  Do they go on Welfare?

 

My next questions are what does privatization look like?  What are the public services that can be sold off?  IS there any private money that can come in to fix it….or will Detroit just cease to exist?  Does Detroit just get bulldozed down?  Where do the displaced people go?  Do they become marauding, desperate masses…..robbing and pillaging other communities?

 

It all sounds very destabalizing and undesirable.  What do you think?  Please help me to understand how/why privatization is the best thing that can happen.

 

It seems to me that what Detroit needs is better management and more people with jobs paying taxes.  While it may seem satisfying to say the people of Detroit should be held accountable and punished for bad decision making, the down side for the rest us is that we will be punished as well.  When you have a disfunctional or troubled child....do you abandon it? 



Diana,, your not going to pull me into a political debate,, I hate politics !   LOL I'll leave that to you and your brother..:) I will answer one of your questions though,,IMHO,,it's not a child and shouldn't be looked at it in the same light.

 

I'm pretty sure though, the guy you voted for President will bail them out. ;)



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Diana3316
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Posted on Sat, Aug 03, 2013 11:20

Hey NGl~

Thanks for your response.  My brother lives in Dearborn and is an engineer for Ford.  We are polar opposites politically…..so as you can imagine Thanksgivings are lots of fun at Mother’s house!   *wink*

 

I don’t know a lot about bankruptcy law, but my general understanding is that the party defaults on what is owed.  Hmm….so if Detroit doesn’t want to default on their sports arena….or sell their Picasso artwork….what are they going to default on?  And what happens to all those people losing pensions?  Do they go on Welfare?

 

My next questions are what does privatization look like?  What are the public services that can be sold off?  IS there any private money that can come in to fix it….or will Detroit just cease to exist?  Does Detroit just get bulldozed down?  Where do the displaced people go?  Do they become marauding, desperate masses…..robbing and pillaging other communities?

 

It all sounds very destabalizing and undesirable.  What do you think?  Please help me to understand how/why privatization is the best thing that can happen.

 

It seems to me that what Detroit needs is better management and more people with jobs paying taxes.  While it may seem satisfying to say the people of Detroit should be held accountable and punished for bad decision making, the down side for the rest us is that we will be punished as well.  When you have a disfunctional or troubled child....do you abandon it? 



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NGL2011
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Posted on Sat, Aug 03, 2013 00:57

Diana, Take it from a person who has lived in the area my whole life. Theres more to the story than what that article says. I do feel sorry for the people who are going to take a hit on their pensions, but most of the problems in the city of Detroit are self inflected. The voters of that city, continued to elect Mayors, city counsel members and school board members who are/were corrupt, stole them blind and still supported them. There was a local survey done, and the results were, if Kwame Kilpatrick ever gets out of prison/finally gets free from all the charges against him (which he won't) the people surveyed, he would get elected again. That is so sad !

 

 

 

privatization, is the best thing that could happen to that city !



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